Surname Saturday: Back to Williams from Wales

We're back in the 3rd great grandmothers, having already covered the earlier grandmothers and a bunch of the grandfathers in previous posts using one of my favorite blogging prompts from GeneaBloggers called Surname Saturday! I like this one because I get to reacquaint myself with one part of the family tree and cover ground that's both familiar as well as unfamiliar. That's very useful. And last week I found another cousin! Yippee!

This week we turn our attention to another one of the families who had their roots deep in Wales, the Williams people, but possibly another line of this surname... or not.

This line might be related to the main branch of Williams ancestors because, as you'll see below, Jane James' mother was Elizabeth Williams before she married Daniel James. And her own Williams family lived right close to her husband, Thomas Williams' family in Cardiganshire, Wales. One can't help but connect the merry dots in ones head about that, even without proper documentation!

Let me say that we know what we do about the Williams family, and we're lucky to have that, only because Mom went to Wales years ago.
So in hopes of finding yet another cousin out there googling about the Williams and James lines, here's the line-up... and you'll notice that it looks remarkably similar to last weeks post because we're again talking about the Williams people, but this time without the Edwards family as a side dish:)

1. Diane Kelly Weintraub

2. Francis Patrick "Pat" Kelly (1916 - 2007)
3. Virginia Williams, living and loving it!

6. Cambria "Camey" Williams (1897 - 1960)
7. Emma Susan Whetstone (1897 - 1956)
They had 5 children in all:
3. Virginia, that's Mom
Dorothy Williams Conrad (1920 - 2007)
Evelyn Williams (1921 - 1924)
Margaret Williams (1926 - 1926)
Cambria Williams Jr. (1925 - 1997)

12. Daniel Williams (1852 - 1920)
13. Jane Price (1862 - 1939)
Daniel was born in Strata Florida, Cardigsnshire, Wales. He worked as a collier or coal miner, as his father had, in Wales, immigrated, then moved to the George's Creek Coal Mine Field in Western Maryland, one of the richest veins of coal at the time. Jane was born in Mount Savage, Allegany County, Maryland, just over the hill from where Daniel worked, but her family came from Wales as well. Daniel was a supervisor at the mines and well respected and elected to the school board.
They had 8 children:
James Henry Williams 1882 - 1936)
William Williams (1884 - 1964)
Benjamin Williams (1896 - 1896)
Thomas Williams (1890 - 1951)
Dianna Williams (1892 - 1893)
Joseph Williams (1895 - 1948)
6. Cambria Williams (1897 - 1960), that's Mom's Dad
Charles Williams (1899 - 1979), that's Aunt Betty's Dad

24. Thomas Williams (about 1815 - 1868?)
25. Jane James (about 1815 - ?)
Both Thomas and Jane were born in Strata Florida, Cardigsnshire, Wales. Thomas was a collier or coal miner as were a number of his sons. It is presumed that Thomas died about 1868, possibly in Lampiter, Cardiganshire, Wales. The death record is inconclusive as to confirming identity.
Jane is found in the 1870 Wales Census in Llangattock, Breckenshire, Wales. Interestingly, she's living next to a woman, a widow, by the name of Dianah James, a green grocer.
From there on her life is a mystery. It is presumed that she immigrated and lived, possibly with a daughter or son, in Upstate New York... because we have that photo of her.
They had 7 children:
Elizabeth Williams (24 Oct 1841-?)

David Williams (22 May 1844-?)

Jane Williams (4 Oct 1846-?)
Thomas Williams (25 Mar 1851-?)
12. Daniel Williams (1852 - 1920)
John Williams (Nov 1853-?)
William Williams (23 Jan 1865-?)

50. Daniel James (30 Dec 1792 - 14 Aug 1881)
51. Elizabeth Williams (1788 - Mar 1877)
Both members of this lovely couple were born and died in Cardiganshire, Wales, mostly in and around Strata Florida. They had these children:
25. Jane James (about 1815 - ?)
Elizabeth James ( 1819 - ?)
Ann James (1820 - ?)
David James (1827 - ?)
Mary James (1823 - ?)

There ya' go. End of the line. Tracks run out. That's too bad and now that I've got this all lined up I can see that the census returns could be examined for any trace of Daniel James in Wales from the 1841 time period on. I wonder if he too was a miner as were so very many of his descendants down to Mom's grandfather Williams.

This couple stayed put in Strata Florida, Cardiganshire, Wales throughout their lives and that's where I'd expect to find them in any local records too. I could also look in the Welsh BMD returns for their deaths and order up the death certificate. Yes, there's work to be done here!


Photos from Aunt Betty's Archive:

The URL for this post is: http://nutsfromthefamilytree.blogspot.com/2013/06/surname-saturday-back-to-williams-from.html

Surname Saturday: The Edwards Family from Wales

We're back in the 3rd great grandmothers, having already covered the earlier grandmothers and a bunch of the grandfathers in previous posts using one of my favorite blogging prompts from GeneaBloggers called Surname Saturday! I like this one because I get to reacquaint myself with one part of the family tree and cover ground that's both familiar as well as unfamiliar. I like that:)

This week we turn our attention to one of the families who had their roots deep in Wales, the Edwards people. And I have to say right at the top here, I don't know a thing about them except the names of all the children and we're lucky to have that only because Mom went to Wales years ago. But never mind because in posting this, I or you or a new-to-me cousin might have a thought that could help make connections. Ya' never know!


1. Diane Kelly Weintraub

2. Francis Patrick "Pat" Kelly (1916 - 2007)
3. Virginia Williams, living and loving it!

6. Cambria "Camey" Williams (1897 - 1960)
7. Emma Susan Whetstone (1897 - 1956)
They had 5 children in all:
3. Virginia, that's Mom
Dorothy Williams Conrad (1920 - 2007)
Evelyn Williams (1921 - 1924)
Margaret Williams (1926 - 1926)
Cambria Williams Jr. (1925 - 1997)

12. Daniel Williams (1852 - 1920)
13. Jane Price (1862 - 1939)
Daniel was born in Strata Florida, Cardigsnshire, Wales. He worked as a collier or coal miner, as his father had, in Wales, immigrated, then moved to the George's Creek Coal Mine Field in Western Maryland, one of the richest veins of coal at the time. Jane was born in Mount Savage, Allegany County, Maryland, just over the hill from where Daniel worked, but her family came from Wales as well. Daniel was a supervisor at the mines and well respected and elected to the school board.
They had 8 children:
James Henry Williams 1882 - 1936)
William Williams (1884 - 1964)
Benjamin Williams (1896 - 1896)
Thomas Williams (1890 - 1951)
Dianna Williams (1892 - 1893)
Joseph Williams (1895 - 1948)
6. Cambria Williams (1897 - 1960), that's Mom's Dad
Charles Williams (1899 - 1979), that's Aunt Betty's Dad

24. Thomas Williams (about 1815 - 1868?)
25. Jane James (about 1815 - ?)
Both Thomas and Jane were born in Strata Florida, Cardigsnshire, Wales. Thomas was a collier or coal miner as were a number of his sons. It is presumed that Thomas died about 1868, possibly in Lampiter, Cardiganshire, Wales. The death record is inconclusive as to confirming identity.
Jane is found in the 1870 Wales Census in Llangattock, Breckenshire, Wales. Interestingly, she's living next to a woman, a widow, by the name of Dianah James, a green grocer.
We have that mystery photo of Jane James Williams with her adult children taken by a photographer in Troy, New York... however, neither Mom nor Aunt Betty or silly me have been able to find a lick of a track of them in New York state! That's our brick wall.
They had 7 children:

Elizabeth Williams (24 Oct 1841-?)

David Williams (22 May 1844-?)

Jane Williams (4 Oct 1846-?)
Thomas Williams (25 Mar 1851-?)
12. Daniel Williams (1852 - 1920)
John Williams (Nov 1853-?)

William Williams (23 Jan 1865-?)

48. David Williams (?- 1838)
49. Rachel Edwards (dates not known to us)
Again, this family was born and died in Strata Florida, Cardigsnshire, Wales.
They had 6 children:
24. Thomas Williams (about 1815 - 1868?)
David Williams (1811 - ?)
Edward Williams (1814 - ?)
Elizabeth Williams (1816 - ?)
Catherine Williams (1819 - 1823)
Catherine Williams (1824 - ?)

There you have it, sadly. That's just about all we know about the end of the line. We're back in the late 1700s in Wales and good luck on that! It's on my bucket list to go to the National Archives and see what can be found. Some fine day:)


Photo taken at Troy NY. Can you help us match the names with the faces? Do you know of any of these people? Any guesses as to what year this was taken?

The Girls:

Elizabeth (24 Oct 1841-?) she's the oldest girl so is that her on the right, standing?

Jane (4 Oct 1846-?) is that her on the left in the fancy dress? Mom thinks that she is the wife of the man sitting to the left of her. What do you think?
 

The Boys, one is missing:
David (22 May 1844-?)

Thomas (25 MAR 1851-?)

John (Nov 1853-?)

William (23 Jan 1865-?)

Daniel my GGF (31 MAR 1852 - 19 APR 1920) is seated on the right
and his mother Jane Price Williams (1815-?) is seated to the left of him

The URL for this post is: http://nutsfromthefamilytree.blogspot.com/2013/06/surname-saturday-edwards-family-from.html

Surname Saturday: The James Family From Wales

Here's the next post in the series, Surname Saturday, the blogging prompt from GeneaBloggers. We're into the 5th generation and my 2nd great grandmothers. This is fun, and it's perfect cousin bait;) Plus, I get to see the dead ends and holes in research and logic, then make research notes about both. I'll get there, eventually!


1. Diane Kelly Weintraub

2. Francis Patrick Kelly (1916 - 2007)
3. Virginia Williams, living and loving it!

6. Cambria Williams (1897 - 1960)
7. Emma Susan Whetstone (1897 - 1956)

12. Daniel Williams (1852 - 1920)
13. Jane Price (1862 - 1939)

24. Thomas Williams (about 1815 - 1868?)
25. Jane James (20 July 1815 - ????)
Both Thomas and Jane were born in Strata Florida, Cardigsnshire, Wales. Thomas was a collier or coal miner as were a number of his sons. It is presumed that Thomas died about 1868, possibly in Lampiter, Cardiganshire, Wales. The death record is inconclusive as to confirming identity.
Jane is found in the 1870 Wales Census in Llangattock, Breckenshire, Wales. Interestingly, she's living next to a woman, a widow, by the name of Dianah James, a green grocer.
We have that mystery photo of Jane James Williams with her adult children taken by a photographer in Troy, New York... however, neither Mom nor Aunt Betty or silly me have been able to find a lick of a track of them in New York state! That's our brick wall.
They had 7 children:

Elizabeth Williams (24 Oct 1841 - ????)

David Williams (22 May 1844 - ????)

Jane Williams (4 Oct 1846 - ????)
Thomas Williams (25 Mar 1851- ????)
Daniel Williams (1852 - 1920)
John Williams (Nov 1853 - ????)
William Williams (23 Jan 1865 - ????)

50. Daniel James (30 Dec 1792 - 14 Aug 1881)
51. Elizabeth Williams (1788 - Mar 1877)
This couple were both born in Cardiganshire, Wales, he in Strata Florida. We don't know specifically where she was born but they were married on 25 Nov 1814 in Strata Florida, Cardiganshire, Wales at the Strata Florida Chapel. Specifically, Daniel died in Allt Du, Parish of Caron Uwch Clawdd, Cardiganshire, Wales. Mom went to Wales and tracked down some of this information but she didn't have near enough time. She even had a nice volunteer researcher meet her at the National Archive but the flight left the next day! Guess I'll have to go some day:)
They had the following children:
25. Jane James (20 July 1815 - ????)
Elizabeth James (2 Nov 1819 - ????)
Ann James (25 Sept 1820 - ????)
David James (10 Mar 1821 - ????)
Daniel James (19 Oct 1827 - ????)
Mary James (2 Dec 1832 - ????)

100. John James (dates unknown)
101. Margaret LNU (born about 1761 - ????)
Sorry, don't know Margaret's last name so using the convention of LNU, or Last Name Unknown.  Because Daniel James was born in Strata Florida, Cardiganshire, Wales, it can be assumed that they lived there at one point, and that will be my starting point for future research.
They had at least one child:
50. Daniel James (30 Dec 1792 - 14 Aug 1881)

Well, that runs out unceremoniously, doesn't it? Too bad for Mom and me.

WANTED!

Information leading to the location of Jane James Williams from Wales!



Here she is in a photo taken in Troy NY, date unknown, with all of her children except one.

And here's a close-up.

Born 20 July 1815.

 

I dunno, maybe if I try this as a Wanted poster, I might get somewhere locating her in the States...? Should a reward be offered??

 

 

The URL for this post is: http://nutsfromthefamilytree.blogspot.com/2013/04/surname-saturday-james-family-from-wales.html

Wishful Wednesday: Jane Price Williams, Come On Down!

Here's a new blogging prompt from GeneaBloggers, called Wishful Wednesdays. I am really enjoying being floated along by their blogging prompts and this new one challenges the imagination! The page for Wishful Wednesdays says, "What ancestor do you wish you could have met?"

Well, Mom and I chatted about this recently and we said that we'd really love to have just 5 minutes with her grand father, Daniel Williams (1852 - 1920). But when I read this blogging prompt, I thought, wait, what about his wife?! The wife knows the real stories, doesn't she? Yeah, she does. The Man of the House might put a gloss over the facts and spin that yarn bigger than life, but the wife knows where the bodies are hidden;)

To that end, I'd like to spend my half-hour (and here's hoping I'd get a half-hour because five minutes isn't enough) with Jane Price Williams (1862 - 1939), Daniel's wife.

Nice hat, Granny Jane!

 

Hi, Jane, or should I call you Grand Ma Ma?

All right then I'll call you Granny Jane.

Tell me about the house that sunk when the miners dug under it. Was that scary? Aunt Betty says that the miner's voices could be heard in the house, is that right?

So Aunt Betty had it correct! Sounds scary to me... oh I know, we lead a soft life: indoor plumbing, refrigeration and cars for everyone. But I do find it strange that houses were built on land that the owner of the house didn't have the mineral rights to, so that the mining company could dig a mine right under the house! Oh yes, to be sure, different times.

What I really want to ask you about is that photo taken of Pap Daniel with his mother and siblings in Troy, New York. Here it is.

Daniel Williams is seated on the right and his mother,

Jane James Williams (1815 - ????), is seated to his left.

Would you tell me about how he came to get up to Troy, New York, and where they all lived, please? This has been making me and Mom, and Aunt Betty crazy. Oh, my Mom is your son Cambria's oldest daughter and Aunt Betty is your son Charles' daughter. Oh, they are cute, aren't they?

Mom at about a year old with her parents,

Cambria Williams and Emma Susan Whetstone.

Aunt Betty's high school graduation photo.

She's Charles William's daughter.

 

 

So, Granny Jane, what about that photo with Daniel and his mother and all? We're very curious about that.

 

And can you tell me the full story of how he came to be the person to escort the record setting lump of coal from the George's Creek Mine fields in Ocean, Maryland to the World's Fair in Chicago, 1893? That must have been an exciting time! Tell me all about that, did he bring back souvenirs? Is that when he went to see his mother and siblings? Was he very proud? Was it written up in the Frostburg Mining Journal?

 

What?!! We're out of time?!! Oh, no!!! Don't go now!! Darn, I talked to much and didn't listen enough, as usual. Bummer.



The URL for this crazy post is:  http://nutsfromthefamilytree.blogspot.com/2013/02/wishful-wednesday-jane-price-williams.html

Surname Saturday: Williams from Wales

Well here's my second go at Surname Saturday, a blogging prompt brought to us by GeneaBloggers and their Daily Blogging Prompts. This week I'm jumping into Mom's father's folks, the Williams family from Wales and one of our really really big brick walls: they disappear once they get to America! I'd give just about anything in fair trade to find GGF Daniel William's siblings after they presumably immigrated. It's a mystery that's stumped my betters, and that's Mom and Aunt Betty.

So here we go on a surname romp back along the line that is all Wales! I'll share what we know and what we'd love to find out.

1. Diane Kelly Weintraub

2. Francis Patrick Kelly (1916 - 2007)
3. Virginia Williams, living and loving it!

6. Cambria Williams (1897 - 1960)
7. Emma Susan Whetstone (1897 - 1956)
They had 5 children in all:
Virginia, that's Mom
Dorothy Williams Conrad (1920 - 2007)
Evelyn Williams (1921 - 1924)
Margaret Williams (1926 - 1926)
Cambria Williams Jr. (1925 - 1997)

12. Daniel Williams (1852 - 1920)
13. Jane Price (1862 - 1939)
Daniel was born in Strata Florida, Cardigsnshire, Wales. He worked as a collier or coal miner, as his father had, in Wales, immigrated, then moved to the George's Creek Coal Mine Field in Western Maryland, one of the richest veins of coal at the time. Jane was born in Mount Savage, Allegany County, Maryland, just over the hill from where Daniel worked, but her family came from Wales as well.
Neither Mom nor Aunt Betty, both grandchildren of this pair, remember Welsh being spoken at home or at church.
Daniel was a supervisor at the mines and well respected and elected to the school board.
They had 8 children:
James Henry Williams 1882 - 1936)
William Williams (1884 - 1964)
Benjamin Williams (1896 - 1896)
Thomas Williams (1890 - 1951)
Dianna Williams (1892 - 1893)
Joseph Williams (1895 - 1948)
Cambria Williams (1897 - 1960), that's Mom's Dad
Charles Williams (1899 - 1979), that's Aunt Betty's Dad

24. Thomas Williams (about 1815 - 1868?)
25. Jane James (about 1815 - ?)
Both Thomas and Jane were born in Strata Florida, Cardigsnshire, Wales. Thomas was a collier or coal miner as were a number of his sons. It is presumed that Thomas died about 1868, possibly in Lampiter, Cardiganshire, Wales. The death record is inconclusive as to confirming identity.
Jane is found in the 1870 Wales Census in Llangattock, Breckenshire, Wales. Interestingly, she's living next to a woman, a widow, by the name of Dianah James, a green grocer.
We have that mystery photo of Jane James Williams with her adult children taken by a photographer in Troy, New York... however, neither Mom nor Aunt Betty or silly me have been able to find a lick of a track of them in New York state! That's our brick wall.
They had 7 children:

Elizabeth Williams (24 Oct 1841-?)

David Williams (22 May 1844-?)

Jane Williams (4 Oct 1846-?)
Thomas Williams (25 Mar 1851-?)
Daniel Williams (1852 - 1920)

John Williams (Nov 1853-?)

William Williams (23 Jan 1865-?)

48. David Williams (?- 1838)
49. Rachel Edwards (dates not known to us)
Again, this family was born and died in Strata Florida, Cardigsnshire, Wales.
They had 6 children:
Thomas Williams (about 1815 - 1868?)
David Williams (1811 - ?)
Edward Williams (1814 - ?)
Elizabeth Williams (1816 - ?)
Catherine Williams (1819 - 1823)
Catherine Williams (1824 - ?)

Mom visited Wales and the Archive at the National Library of Wales in the 1980s but unfortunatly ran out of time. So this is the end of the line for this branch of the tree, and there's no more to tell right now. Perhaps later.

Here are some photos for your amusement, and especially because this Surname Saturday is short.

This is that Mystery Photo taken by Towne Studio, Troy NY, 37 Fourth St.
There's Daniel Williams seated on the right next to his mother Jane James Williams, also seated.

Here are GGF Daniel's siblings and their birth dates as follows,

The Girls:

Elizabeth (24 Oct 1841-?) she's the oldest girl so is that her on the right?

Jane (4 Oct 1846-?) is that her on the left in the fancy dress?

The Boys:
David (22 May 1844-?)

Thomas (25 MAR 1851-?)

John (Nov 1853-?)

William (23 Jan 1865-?)



 

Daniel Williams eventually purchased two mines: a coal mine in Mt. Savage, Allegany County, Maryland, and a tin mine in West Virginia. His plan was to work the mines with his sons. The tin mine was lost for back taxes in the 1930s. The land and farm from the Mt. Savage property is still in the family and owned by a Williams descendant.

Mom with her parents,

Cambria Williams and Emma Susan Whetstone, about 1920.

Cute, huh?!

The URL for this post is: http://nutsfromthefamilytree.blogspot.com/2013/01/surname-saturday-williams-from-wales.html

Gone to the Family History Center

Whenever I feel stuck researching my British Isles ancestors, I go to the local Family History Center. Am very lucky indeed to have a fine one here in San Diego. On one specific day of the week the British Isles expert is there, delightful, and very willing to help. The strategy for me is to get organized so as not to waste her time shuffling papers, and pinpoint specifics before hand with which she can give some guidance.

My main task for this visit was to get more background on my great great grandmother, Jane James Williams (1815 - ????). I have been spending considerable time look for her coming to America with inconclusive results. Feel like I might not be looking in the right place. Something is wrong because neither Mom, Aunt Betty nor I can find any trace of the family here in the USA, in spite of having a photo of them all together taken in Troy New York. Stepping back from this brick wall, I want to know as much background as possible about their life in Wales leading up to their immigration.

I showed her the photo, proving once again to myself that they all came here, and then gave her the short version of my Welsh findings. She just up and asked what she could do for me right at the moment I was going to tell her what I was after! She's sharp!

What I wanted was her to just talk and tell me whatever came to her mind about life in Wales in the mid-1800s for a mining family in DYFED, South Wales. I'm glad I did it this way because she spilled out way more background information than I might have stumbled into otherwise. Here's a situation when asking an open ended question is way better than asking a closed end question:)

Here's a laundry list of just a few of the gems she brought up.

* The tin mining had dried up in Cornwall and so a lot of the miners went into Wales to work. Mining was mining and it didn't matter what was being mined.

* The miners were used to traveling for work and could easily be missing for census. She reminded me that the census was simply an inventory of who slept there last night, not family units per se.

* Filamore's Atlas and Index is a good source for finding towns and then looking for where the records were kept, the deposited dates, the IGI, and Registration District, all info needed to take the next step in finding the actual record.

* FreeBMD. She gave me an quick introduction to FreeBMD, my new fav toy, and how to find records. We plugged in what we knew and quickly went to Jane and Thomas's marriage record! Then she showed me how to order it online. Cool!

* My ancestors were religious non-conformists and were members of the Congregational Church when they got here. She said to look at Calvinistic-Methodists records as well as Congregational records. Checking it out on WIKIpedia I get a clearer picture of church affairs and notice a Peter Williams playing a roll. Wonder if he fits in to our tree... although Williams is as common as Smith here!

There was so much more in our two hour conversation! Am so glad I went!!

Image from the Archive:

Old Map of South Wales from
Filamore's Atlas and Index

The URL for this post is: http://nutsfromthefamilytree.blogspot.com/2012/09/gone-to-family-history-center.html

Looking For The Widow Jane: Passenger Lists

Am looking for my maternal GGGM, Jane James Williams (1815 - ?). Just to recap, she was born in Wales in 1815, married Thomas Williams there in 1841. They had six children but he died in 1868. We find her in the Wales Census of 1871, and Census records before that. But try as I might - and believe me I've done nothing but try to find her in US records - I come up empty. So either I'm way off base and don't know beans about doing genealogy (and that's quite possible;) or something is wrong with what we assume to be true about her.

The only solid evidence we have of her after the Wales Census of 1871 is the photo taken in Troy New York with five of her six adult children, date unknown. My GGF, Daniel Williams (1852 - 1920) is in it on the right. His mother, Jane is to the left of him. Both are seated. So there she was in a photo taken in New York, big as life! And I ought to be able to find her in US records, right? You'd think!

This exercise in hunting Jane is testing my resolve... and what few powers of genealogy know-how that might have rubbed off from Mom on to this relative newbie are not adequate. I've looked in US and New York State Census records and come up empty with no solid conclusions but lots of speculations... can you even guess how common the name Jane Williams is?! I've looked for an obit with no luck at finding my Jane Williams.

My latest exercise is to look in passenger lists. We can safely presume that if she was born in Wales and is in the census there in 1841 to 1871, and then she makes an appearance in that New York photo, she probably came on a ship. So far, so good.

I've perused the passenger lists on Ancestry but this morning I was anxious to dig deeper so went to the Steve Morse 1Step web portal at http://stevemorse.org/ It's a powerhouse of access and has super search engines built in. (Thanks again, Steve!)

I found that the less I enter in the way of data, as we hear many a time, the more results I get. Just to see what might happen I did the exact same search on Ancestry as well as the 1Step and the results were similar but slightly different, and that was curious and instructive. The 1Step results yielded 121 very reasonable responses. Ancestry just about couldn't stop bringing me stuff... 12 full 50 entry pages... like a young dog trying to please:) But out of all that dog pile of returns only 70 were appropriate matches for the search terms.

Interesting. That said, I'm sifting through the results and still looking for Jane!

Today's photo from The Archive:

My GF, Cambria "Camey" Williams, 1897 - 1960

The URL for this post is: http://nutsfromthefamilytree.blogspot.com/2012/08/looking-for-widow-jane-passanger-lists.html

The Widow Jane Comes To American: Yeah, But Where?

Have been looking in earnest my GGM, Jane James Williams (1815 - ?) born in Wales and making an appearance in a photo taken in Troy, New York about 1900. She's found easily enough in Welsh records but once on US soil, she's hiding from me!

I need a place name for her - a city or county - before I can dig deep, so I started looking for an obituary for her. Searched Ancesrty.com, Old Fulton, and GenealogyBank.com. Also checked FindAGrave. There are a lot of Jane Williams out there! But not mine, at least as far as I can tell. Then I rummaged around cemeteries in and around Utica and Troy NY where there were a lot of Welsh immigrants.

And I've tried the US Census for 1880 and 1900. Sure could use that 1890 census, but who hasn't said that?! Then on to look at the New York state census for 1892. She doesn't show up in any of these.

Either I'm simply looking right at her and not recognizing her or something else happened to her. Maybe she died right after coming to the US after her husband died in 1868? But then why is she in that photo taken presumably about 1900? Did she remarry when she landed here and acquired a new last name... and if so I'll probably never find her? Is she not in Upstate New York at all?

I remember a lecture Joel Weintraub (no relation that we know of) gave on the 1940 US Census. At some point or other he said something like, all genealogy is geography. That stuck with me and I'm guessing that the missing Widow Jane is just such a case. I really do need to locate her geography!

Jane, oh Jane: come out, come out, wherever you are!

Photo of the day from the Archive:

Jane James Williams (1815 - ?)

Photo taken by Towne Studio, Troy NY

The URL for this post is: http://nutsfromthefamilytree.blogspot.com/2012/08/the-widow-jane-comes-to-american-yeah.html

Moving From Utica To Troy NY

Have been looking for my great, great grandmother Jane James Williams (1815 - ?) born in Wales and presumably died in upstate New York. (See posts below for the full saga of this search.)

Mom and Aunt Betty mentioned a connection to the Utica area and there were a lot of Welsh immigrants who settled there. But my digging around Utica has come up with nothing. So on to Troy and Renesselear County where that photo was taken of Jane and six of her seven children!

It's kind of funny but when I was browsing around the Utica records of 1880-ish I just couldn't see my Williams ancestors living there, and the more I looked the less connected they seemed to this area, in spite of the big Welsh population. It's a heavy farming area and they weren't farming folks. I know, I know, that's just a feeling and not a fact you can site, but ... well, it's what I have at the moment. And it "feels" pretty strong. That said I won't stop looking for them in Utica 'cause ya never know.

On the other hand from the moment I started reading about Troy there was a connected feeling. My ancestors were miners, carpenters, and engineers (as best I can tell right now.) And as such they would have fit in well and found employment in the Troy area. Nope, they weren't farmers.

I'm obsessed with these people! What happened to them in Upstate New York? Why did they then seem to disappear out of the records? Where did they go? Did they go west just as my GGF went south and west to Western Maryland to work in the coal mines as a supervisor, get married, buy a house, have a bunch of kids? Jane, talk to me!!

Photos of the Day from Aunt Betty's Archive:

That photo taken in Troy NY by
TOWNE, 47 Third Street

The URL for this post is: http://nutsfromthefamilytree.blogspot.com/2012/08/moving-from-utica-to-troy-ny.html

Grasping at Straws?

Am busy looking for and not finding my GGM Jane James Williams (1815 - ?) born in Wales and who, by family oral tradition, died in upstate New York, and Utica is mentioned most often. (See posts below.) Jane is elusive to put it mildly!

Yesterday I got frustrated with all the looking and not finding so I thought I'd change it up to get rid of the boredom. Went on Ancestry.com and started searching member trees for my GGF Daniel Williams' (1852 - 1920) brothers. Started by looking for William who was born 23 Jan 1856 and the youngest offspring of Jane and Thomas. By looking at the Williams family group photo taken in Troy NY about 1890 - 1900 you can just about guess which one is William.

I didn't hold out much hope of finding anything useful on Ancestry member trees, so there was no pressure and I had fun browsing. I always learn something when I browse in a relaxed manner because my mind is free to take notice of random items and develop possible patterns. Ever do that? You're just browsing and you think, hey there sure are a ton of Williams people in Marcy, Oneida County, New York... that's super interesting! And there were.

Along the way I noticed a Ancestry member tree with a photo of a William John Williams born in 1859 in Wales. In the 1910 census he's living with Jane Williams age 74, or 72. That means that Jane was born in 1836 or so and for sure is not our Jane Williams born in 1815. But the photo was interesting. OK, so maybe I wanted to see a family resemblance;)

See what happens when I get bored when I'm looking and not finding!

Photo of the day from an Ancestry Member Tree and my Archive:

The two William Williams'.
Ours is on the right.
Am thinking the chins are different.

The URL for this post is: http://nutsfromthefamilytree.blogspot.com/2012/08/grasping-at-straws.html

Data Back-up Day

It's a custom, at least in the genealogy community, to back up your data the first day of every month. It's a really nice idea and it's lovely to see reminders on blogs to do it. It's like neighbors checking in to be sure you put out the garbage on the appointed day when they don't see your bin at the curb.

I use Carbonite for data back up. I have tons of photos and other graphic files so I need lots of storage and that means paying for it. The $60 or so a year is cheap insurance... especially last year after my computer crashed! I've been through a couple of computer crashes - I wait until the computer dies an ugly death, and probably shouldn't do that but maybe I like the thrill of getting every penny out of my computer investment. It's perverse;) When the other older computers died I panicked wondering when the last back-up was. Not now. My online back up service is always busy doing back-up. I like that.

That said, I don't trust anything! So here sits an external terabyte hard drive that also holds my photos, graphics, and genealogy files. And next to it is another external terabyte drive. Redundancy is my middle name;)

Hey, whatever makes you feel safe cause feeling safe with your data is the very best!

Today's photo from the Archive:

This photo is a bit of a mystery to me but
maybe Mom or Aunt Betty can help figure it out.
The back says, "Daniel Williams mother and father"

That would be Thomas Williams who died in Wales in 1865

and Jane James Williams (1815 - ?).

Jane is the one I'm trying to find in upstate New York. (See posts below.)

Can it be that this photo was taken before 1865?

The URL for this post is: http://nutsfromthefamilytree.blogspot.com/2012/08/data-back-up-day.html

The Widow Jane Comes To America: Part II

Am busy searching (and not finding so easily) the immigration records of Jane James Williams (1815 - ?), widowed in 1865, and her family. Maybe I'll find them and maybe they'll continue to hide from me, but along the way this relative newbie is learning all kinds of stuff I didn't know. And I love that!

I found by google search a master's thesis by Paul Demund Evans written in 1914 entitled, "The Welsh in Oneida County, New York." It's a real treasure trove of background info to put some color on the family's immigration in the 1870s. And in it I find that the Williams people of Wales were amongst the very first settlers in Upstate New York and specifically Oneida County. Here's a link to it in case you're interested:
http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~nyunywh/oneidawelsh/index.html

By 1850 a great many Welsh coal miners were thinking about immigration. The potato crop had failed in Wales in 1846, the winter following was harsh with heavy snows and a wet spring. Thunderstorms in the summer of 1847 were destructive and damaged crops. Families fell into famine and deceases broke out. The next harvest was good and imports from America insured enough to eat but drove down prices for farming families looking to cash in. By 1849 and 1850 manufacturing and mining were hit hard economically. Reading Evans thesis I got to the point of asking, how much can these people take? The Welsh are a hearty and somewhat stubborn folk, it is said, but gosh!

By the time of Thomas' death in 1865, Jane's husband, the tide of Welsh immigration to America had tapered off. Here is a sampling from the table in the Appendix: Numbers of Welsh Immigrants to the United States.
YEAR/ NYC
1865 / 505
1868 / 699
1870 / 545
Those totals are down from more than 2000 per year to NYC in 1851 and 1852, with 1848 to 1852 experiencing the greatest numbers of people leaving Wales for America.

The Evans thesis outlines a narrative of the immigrant experience before the establishment of Castle Garden in 1855. Yikes! As if the passage wasn't precarious enough with poor accommodations, rations, rats, disease and the vagaries of weather to extend the voyage, once here there was a crook at every wharf waiting to prey on them! Welsh speaking runners would grab up luggage supposedly for safe keeping, and send it to a boarding house. The unsuspecting immigrant, speaking only Welsh, went to the boarding house with the runner, was given a sales pitch and usually checked in. The overly friendly runner pressured them to buy transport tickets from him. Many did, only to find later that they were overcharged. Some tickets were worthless. At the close of their stay, boarding rates were hiked and a new hidden fee was charged for storage of the luggage.

Castle Garden put a stop to all of that. Not only were officials able to document and manage the influx of immigrants but agents speaking native tongues were best able to offer genuine help. Transport to certified boarding houses was provided and ticket sales to upstate location were sold within Castle Gardens. Jane and family likely came over through Castle Gardens so they would have been relatively safe from the runner's mischief, which eases my mind:)

As I read the Evans thesis I thought of Jane and family, and especially my GGF Daniel, on every page.


Today's photo from the Archive from Aunt Betty:

The URL for this post is: http://nutsfromthefamilytree.blogspot.com/2012/07/the-widow-jan-comes-to-america-part-ii.html

The Widow Jane Comes To America: Part I

Jane James Williams was born on 31 July, 1815 in Strata Florida, Cardiganshire, Wales. She was born into a time of severe economic downturn. Families were eligible for relief funds based on how many children they had and so they brought yet more children into the world to beef up the subsistence funds. Not saying that Jane's family did this, just setting the stage for an understanding of the times.

Jane James married Thomas Williams on 29 January, 1841 in the Chapel at Strata Florida in Cardiganshire. Jane and Thomas appear in the 1851 Wales Census in the town of Caron, Cardiganshire: Thomas Williams age 35 working as a miner, his wife Jane age 35, Elizabeth 9, Jane 6, Daniel 2 months, who is to be my GGF. In the 1861 Wales census they are in the same place with more children: Thomas 10, John 7, and William 5. That's all the children they'd have and Thomas would die in 1865.

So there was Jane left with 6 children. The passage to America was not going to be cheap or easy. But what was she to do? Her two oldest children were girls and she could put them out as servants. Coincidentally, the 1851 census also shows on the next page an Eliz. Williams, saying she's 25, working as a servant. The same person? Daniel, the oldest boy, was 16 and could possibly work in the mines if that was allowed... and it night be interesting to do some research Welsh mines of the period.

The Wales census for 1871 reveals that Jane is now widowed and Daniel is working in the mines. They have moved to Breckenshire. Mom thinks they moved to be closer to Jane's relatives and there is a Dianah James also a widow, 31 years old, living next door to Jane... and remember that Jane's maiden name was James. Dianah works as a green grocer. Is she Jane's sister-in-law and the kids Aunt Dianah?

Daniel's sibs are all there in the 1871 census except for Thomas who would be 21 years old. Did he marry? Or did he already immigrate? I need to pursue that lead... but Thomas Williams is a very common Welsh name, so good luck to me.

What would you do? Would you send your oldest boy on ahead? Maybe. Mom found a Daniel Williams with Elizabeth (and Elizabeth was his oldest sister's name) arriving in New York on 2 May, 1873. Or did Thomas go on ahead, or did he stay behind with a wife and work in the coal mines? Is Thomas one of the brothers in that photo that's burning a place in my brain?

You know who is not in the Wales census of any year? David. He was born 22 May 1844 and the oldest boy. Strange. Maybe he's the one missing from the Troy NY photo of Jane and her children?

They all came to America, I know they did because of that photo. But when and who came first? As usual, more question than answers:)


Photo of the day from Wikipedia:

The Abbey at Strata Florida.

The Wikipedia link:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strata_Florida_Abbey

The URL for this post is: http://nutsfromthefamilytree.blogspot.com/2012/07/the-widow-jane-comes-to-america-part-i.html

A Research Plan for Jane James Williams 1815 - ?

OK, here's the story. My GGF on my Mom's side was Daniel Williams (1852 - 1920), born in Wales to Thomas Williams (abt. 1815- 1868) and Jane James Williams (1815 - ?). After Daniel's father Thomas died in 1868, it is thought that the family moved to the USA. Daniel then moved to Western Maryland and worked as a coal miner, raising a large family, owning a home, and becoming a recognized member of the community.

After Daniel's Mother Jane and sibs moved the to the USA, we lose tract of them. They presumably move to the upstate New York area because Aunt Betty has a family photo of Mother Jane and her adult children taken in Troy, NY, about 1880 - 1890 or so, as best we can guess by the clothing. And pretty much, that's all we know for sure right now.

I have about a ton and a half's worth of questions! So what happened? What's the full story? How did Jane decide to move to the USA... that was pretty brave for a widow, no? Why did they come to upstate NY? Did they all come at once or a few at a time? So what's the story... what happened to them? Where did Daniel's family go? It's unlikely that they simply disappeared off the face of the earth. I need a solid research plan!

I talked to Mom this morning - and she's doing much better after her fall 3 weeks ago, thanks for asking:) We went over what we know and then what we'd like to find out.

I think I'll start with New York State records for the area around Troy. The lead is that photo of mother Jane and six of her seven children.
The two girls are there in the picture:
Elizabeth (24 Oct 1841-?), and
Jane (4 Oct 1846-?).
There there is GGF Daniel, seated on the right side of the photo next to his mother Jane. Mom, Aunt Betty and I have spent some time trying to match up the boys with the photo, knowing that one is missing.
For the record, the boys are:
David (22 May 1844-?),
Thomas (25 Mar 1851-?),
Daniel my GGF (31 Mar 1852- 19 Apr 1920),
John (Nov 1853-?), and
William (23 Jan 1865-?).
But which of the boys is missing?
So we do know that Jane was alive when this photo was taken, whenever that was. I'll need to study up on the available records for the area because I'm clueless:)

I think I need to start timelines for Daniel and his parents. In the past, timelines have been especially helpful to me. I use them in a very loose fashion and feel free to make copious notes anywhere and everywhere. They are for sure not your Family Tree Maker's timelines;)

Then it will be time to take a look at the good old US Census. Hopefully by that time and after looking into NY State records I might have a better idea of where in upstate NY to look. Hopefully. Those brothers will be my first target.

I want to check immigration records looking for when they came over. Mom says that she has tried without much luck, with the exception of perhaps finding Daniel and Elizabeth on the SS Wyoming on 2 May 1873. Want to spend time verifying that and seeing if the original record image contains any other clues. My bet is that if there are other clues Mom and Aunt Betty would have already found them... but I get lucky every once in a while.

Can cemetery records help? I could really use a location to narrow the search. Hope I find one!

Have my work cut out for me!! And as usual, any thoughts you might have are very much appreciated:)


Photo from the Archive of the Williams Family taken at Troy NY. Can you help us match the names with the faces?

The Girls:

Elizabeth (24 Oct 1841-?) she's the oldest girl so is that her on the right?

Jane (4 Oct 1846-?) is that her on the left in  the fancy dress?

The Boys:
David (22 May 1844-?)

Thomas (25 MAR 1851-?)

John (Nov 1853-?)

William (23 Jan 1865-?)

Daniel my GGF (31 MAR 1852- 19 APR 1920) is seated on the right
and his mother Jane (1815-?) is seated to the left of him

The URL for this post is: http://nutsfromthefamilytree.blogspot.com/2012/07/a-research-plan-for-jane-james-williams.html